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I apologise for posting the above twice in error.

My wife and I attended the same Uk seance with David Thompson as that described by Guy Lyon Playfair. We also witnessed the presence of a materialised Monty Keen, who we knew personally extremely well. My wife had in her pocket a crystal point which had been given to us by Monty Keen a few years earlier. Even I was not aware of its presence there. Monty addressed us both in a voice which was not quite exact with regard to his earthly voice, but which undeniably demonstrated his personality accurately. He told my wife: I believe that you have something of mine there! At which he approached her, put his materialised hand into her pocket, and extracted the crystal point. My wife was the only other person who knew it was there. Neither of us had any doubt that it really was Monty Keen there! Incidentally, Monty dictated his own lengthy eulogy at the same seance.

I state with absolute certainty, that litigation lawyers are best qualified to fully analyze and assess the afterlife evidence. We must at all times seek the guidance of these highly qualified experts.

That's really funny. Also sort of sad.

By promoting Thompson, Zammit has certainly made him a more prominent figure, but also a much more controversial one. Zammit's tendency to exaggerate, and his penchant for attacking anyone who disagrees with him or even asks a question, has made him (and by extension, Thompson) look a bit ridiculous. And what about this weird notion that lawyers are some superior breed of truth-seekers? Most people rate lawyers somewhere near used car dealers in terms of truthfulness.

My wife had in her pocket a crystal point which had been given to us by Monty Keen a few years earlier. Even I was not aware of its presence there... My wife was the only other person who knew it was there.

That's very interesting testimony. One question: It's my understanding that sitters are thoroughly seached at every Thompson seance. Could the person(s) conducting the body search have found the crystal?

Of course, even if the crystal had been found, I doubt it could have been linked with Montague Keen.

How can you witness a materialised person in complete darkness?

"Testimony" and "truth" both begin with the same letter, but in the case of materialization medium, David Thompson, that's the only link between the two that there is.

There are still people who believe the Earth is flat. You can debate them logically and get nowhere, or you can ignore them and get as far away as you can.

Claims of ectoplasm leading to full, partial or semi-partial materialization are the undying relics of 20th century spiritualism, held up primarily by British believers who can't seem to let go of a good yarn.

It is without doubt that the future of consciousness survival research has already left believers of materialization behind, though admittedly, science alone cannot kill a good myth.

To all those people who still have the ability to embrace logic and reason, it's time to walk away from the superstitions of spiritualism, but as with all addictions, I understand that that is easier said than done. You will cite historical anecdotes, you will recite exaggerated first-hand experiences and you will cling to unfounded beliefs that things that go bump in the night do so because "darkness" is a spirit's best friend. You will do all this because, in the end, you would rather die deluded than discredited.

Yet, when you do die and awaken to the truth, please try not to pretend that you knew it all along. Instead, just own up to the fact you were a fool and have a good laugh.

Marcel - sometimes you talk utter nonsense.

Don't tar all people with the same brush.

Full materialisation, admittedly, is rare but that doesn't mean it never existed

I have experienced it in good light unlike you who can only cast aspersions on something you obviously know nothing about.

It is because I have seen the real thing that I can comment without fear or favour.

Zerdini, have you touched a materialised being? In that case, how is the body of that being?

I mean, I've read some of them have the same contexture of any human being, a normal flesh, etc; in other cases, it seems they're more soft, of have other material non-human-like composition. (I suppose it depends on the level of materialisation)

Do they have particular movements or other signs differents than living human being?

Can you share with us some of your direct experiences in that sense?

Thanks

Hi Zetetic chick

Yes. I have touched at least three materialised beings.

I asked the person who claimed to be a guide of mine if I could hold his hands. I gripped them and thought, "now I've got hold of you I'm not going to let go until I get to the bottom of this".

He talked with me for about ten to 15 minutes and told me his name and where he came from. We discussed my spiritual future which I admit I was very sceptical about.

More so when he said that the day would come when I would speak before thousands of people.

I have since spoken on this subject before two thousand three hundred people.

When eventually he said he had to go I said 'ok' still holding his hands very firmly in mine.

I looked down and saw the bottom half of his body dissolving before my eyes as I still held his hands till they dissolved through my fingers and his head was the last to go.

There was nothing to distinguish him from any other living human being.

Another one I touched was a dwarf who asked me to feel his nose which was squashed. I also noticed that he seemed to be attached to the medium by a ribbon of ectoplasm as he walked round the group.

There were only eight of us present.

A Red Indian materialised with a single black feather in a band on top of his head.

He asled me to feel his skin which was copper-coloured and leathery to the touch.

As if sensing my scepticism he asked me to feel his chest and then to hit him on the chest. I did this three times. Each time he said 'Harder' until he told me I could return to my seat. He was very tall - much taller than the medium. I had to reach up to touch his face.

There were others but I did not get to touch them.

The medium was Alec Harris, a Welshman who emigrated to South Africa to be near his son.

Hi Marcel,
Hmm quite a comment
"to walk away from the superstitions of spiritualism, but as with all addictions, I understand that that is easier said than done"

In fact we as Spiritualists with other Spiritualists have been leading voices in this because we are not superstitious and believe in the truth. Spiritualism is much deeper than just the phenomena albeit it does requier that such phenomena is verifiable and real.

The Spiritualists involved also line up a formidable array of experience, intellect and clarity of writing.

Cheers
Jim

Hi Yof,

Without wishing to talk down th experience you had

"My wife and I attended the same Uk seance with David Thompson as that described by Guy Lyon Playfair. We also witnessed the presence of a materialised Monty Keen, who we knew personally extremely well. My wife had in her pocket a crystal point which had been given to us by Monty Keen a few years earlier."

Now clearly by witnessing I take it you mean you heard it as nothing would have been seen. This is the nub of the problem, from my understanding COSC had a form for each attendee and he placed each person in his seat. We therefore have to be certain he had no idea you knew MK well and that your wife had this article following teh search on teh way in.

I have some problems with the whole Keen issue because a member of the former SCR knew his widow who was very unhappy with all of these claims. Also pre the formation of COSC DT received a cogent message from MK from a source Dt then trusted, however he ignored this and went in a direction that was the opposite of the then advice.

Now I would also hesitate to suggest it but I guess your wife thought about this crystal point and the link to MK.

Now as a Medium and Psychic I am not a sceptic but do know that a good psychic can pick that up from her energy. Now I have seen David work psychically very well and also do Mental mediumship so this is well within what I would see as his capability. So there are alternative answers available to explain your experiences although I still do not say it didn't occur in the way you wrote.

I say again we really need better proof to validate claims at the level of those made by Victor and David. Look on the same UK tour a commerative coin for Houdini, dated well after his death, was apported in as proof HH was there do we just accept this or ask why as we did.

That is why so many questions are asked and we lack eyewitnesses because the room is dark. There are inconsistencies throughout which we are asking for clarification upon all though the vast majority of us would like the proof to be positive it is sadly lacking

Zerdini, thank you mery much for sharing your very interesting experiences! They're very impressive, specially the body dissolving before your eyes (it gives a solid sense of certainty to the reality of the phenomenon of materialisation and afterlife).

Thanks!


Hi Zetetic chick

The above was only a fraction of my experiences.

As a longtime follower of magic and illusions I have yet to see any magician dissolve in front of my eyes while I hold their hands!

When I have related my experiences on TV the resident sceptic invariably approaches me after the show and asks if I can get him or her into a seance like that.

Additionally I should add that Alec Harris never charged to attend his seances and if anyone gave him a financial donation he gave it to a children's charity.

‘Doctor’ Zammit has now upgraded himself to ’Professor’ on his website after it was discovered that his Ph.D was from Pacific Western University.

"So, any queries, any guidance, any direction for what is to be allowed in evidence, look for experts such as retired attorney 'Professor' Victor Zammit.” - David Thompson, materialization medium extraordinaire."

As Pacific Western University, i.e., prior to changing its name to California Miramar University, the institution was criticized on multiple occasions as a substandard educational institution or diploma mill.

In May 2004 the US General Accounting Office presented the results of an eight-month examination of diploma mills and other unaccredited schools and federal employees holding their degrees to the U.S. Senate Committee on Governmental Affairs.

Pacific Western University in Los Angeles was one of the six schools on which the investigation focused.

Later that year, investigative reporters from television station KVOA of Tucson, Arizona described the Los Angeles campus of Pacific Western University: "We don't find students, classrooms or professors. Only a small office with two receptionists and a man who introduces himself as the dean."

'Nuff said!

It would seem that David thompson's champion and publicist Mr Zammit, is as controversial and as subject to uncertainty, as is the medium himself.

What a fine pair they make.

Fascinating Z and I just rediscovered the Zammit weekly report where his Killer comments were juxtaposed right alongside his blast against those who raised questions with an onward link to more of what may appear to some to be abuse on his "Materialisation Corner".

It is my understanding that there is a genuine question about VZ's right to use the title Dr too arising from his Phd. Some problem with the issuing university, Pacific Western University of California now California Miramar University (an unaccredited proprietary institution of higher education) but it may only be rumour, so unless we see it we cannot accept this as true although VZ confirms this is the University involved in his own write up. In fact I guess people may be looking at his entire background now but I'm sure he will enlighten us further on all these issues.

Sorry I see the latter part had been covered. Thanks Z

I also note on VZ's record of his background his legal record, with his two outstanding cases occuring within the first two years after an admission as lawyer which must have been exciting. I note that he says both both are well recorded in newspapes so at some stage a chase through internet archives of the Sydney Morning Herald and The Sun in Sydney (both Fairfax Press) could give interested parties a chance to read all about it and get a deeper understanding of his abilities.
To quote Victor's record
"Victor’s admission as a Solicitor of the Supreme Court of New South Wales (admitted on 22nd July 1977) and the High Court of Australia (from 19th September 1977) – are a matter of governmental and lawyers’ records. ……
Victor worked as an attorney in the Local Courts, District and Supreme Courts in Sydney and then in 1993 he became a Company Law consultant and a lecturer in Corporations Law. …….
One significant legal matter Victor was involved in was the R v Borg case in 1979 when he was amongst the first to successfully use ‘dissociative reaction to provocation’ as a defence to murder at the District Court in Parramatta before Mr Justice Yeldham. This is a matter of public record and the case was also reported in The Sydney Morning Herald, a mainstream newspaper in the State of New South Wales………
In November 1978 the Premier of the State of New South Wales’, Mr Neville Wran Queen’s Counsellor, - the equivalent to a State Governor in the United States - appointed Victor with exclusive powers, authority and jurisdiction to enquire into the hostage shooting of Abou-Ali who was an innocent bystander and was taken as a hostage by an armed bank robber Dragosevich. The enquiry was to find out who shot dead the innocent hostage – the police or the bank robber. This procedure was similar to a formal Enquiry Commission. It was one of the most sensational and most controversial cases ever in Australia where Dragosevich, the bank robber, was shot dead by the police. A report on the case was published by the newspaper THE SUN on page 5 Tuesday November 12th 1978 (Fairfax Press), the journalist who reported the case was tough well known Sydney journalist, Peter Charley. Another tough journalist Andrews also reported extensively about it."

Hello i am a tranfiguration medium and i can do transfiguration in semi darkness.I have been to D.Thompson seance in Glasgow and i cant say im 100% convinced.I was being watched all the time by the Zerdin organisers and it made me feel something was wrong.In fact there were two seance and after iv been to the first i wasnt invited to watch the second.I spent a lot of money to travel from malta to Glasgow and i was mistreated.I still think that David is not a fraud but in the dark its a big problem to convince 100%.Anyone visiting Malta is wellcome.

Hi, I do believe that there are psychics, true psychics, but very few and far between.

About David Thompson; in one of the comments, someone state that David Thompson admitted never manifesting a spirit. But I just read 30 different testimonials, and one by a psychic investigator, that said she saw the materialization of Timothy, and william. I am sorry, but I have my doubts too. Number one being, that in this day and age why are medium using the old "trumphet in the Air" act and writing on a chalk board tricks, when we are suppose to be so far advanced in the evidence of life after death. And something else. Why is it in the "EVP" recordings, the voices talk in direct sentences, but when a medium is talking with one of your loved ones, they are talking "charade like" giving symbols, and never , ever , just saying: Hi son, how are you , tell your mother I said HI" Instead; "Something about April, something that devastated you". Why would spirits have to talk through a medium like this , but yet when they materialize they talk in straight sentences, and when people have visitations, they talk normally to them too.

I live in Indiana, and we had a Psychic campground called: "camp Chesterfield". I used to go there, and they are full of crap. No one ever got anything right. Then there was a big falling out, and one of the "mediums" came forth and admitted that is was all a con job, and they laughed at their clients for believing, and told about their props and such. Really made me start thinking. But like I said, In this day and age, and with the genius of science; give me the explanation of quantum physics, EVP's, physic professors telling how we are discovering more dimensions to our universe, discovering the conscieousness, and give me the eastern ideas of Reki, meditation and prayer. I think myself that we can contact the spirits through out of body experiences, NDE's, and meditation.
Psychologist are now able to put people into trances and they have IADC's . This is the stuff I believe in, not flying trumpets, and writings on chalk boards.
These people are Charlatans plain and simple. I will go with quantums, and everyday science is getting closer and closer to proving the afterlife. Check out videos by Professor Radin.

Hi i would suggest that to proove the medium is not doing any tricks,two inches of sand spread on the floor surrounding the medium in the cabinet and at least two meters wide,so if the medium gets out of his cabinet his FOOT PRINTS will be printed in the sand!Also those who are in the room should be barefooted.Chairs should not be in rows but scattered around the room.

"About David Thompson; in one of the comments, someone state that David Thompson admitted never manifesting a spirit. But I just read 30 different testimonials, and one by a psychic investigator, that said she saw the materialization of Timothy, and william. I am sorry, but I have my doubts too."

Thompson admitted to me:

"My answer is simple, I totally agree at this point I am not a full form materialization medium that is able to display the evidence in good light for all to see."

The people who have claimed to have witnessed a materialization simply have no idea what a real materialization is.

They obviously believe without seeing anything.

The reason: It all takes place in complete darkness so how can anyone claim to have WITNESSED a materialization?

It's pure bunkum!

And also, what is the reasoning to be behind a curtain? I doubt that the spirits care less whether David is behind a curtain or sitting in the chair in the dark in front of everyone. The fact that he is behind a curtain, where no one can possibly see him, is obviously, so that he can pull the wool over everyone eyes as he does his side show tricks. I would venture to say that there is a identical chair, that is dropped on the floor after the seance and Mr. Thompson silently runs to the chair afterwards. I imagine he has his own cord for his hands too. Lets take Mr. Thompson in a room without any of his protege, sit him in complete darkness in a chair in front of everyone without a curtain; and lets see if he produces ectoplasm and flying trumpets. He is making a mockery of the spiritual world and everyone else that believes this. Again, it's all about consciousness and the afterlife. I don't know about you but, I don't want a sideshow to convince me that I still live on after death, give me facts, and science is already coming very close to positive truth.
I myself have seen spirits, and other things, but I don't speak of this to people and It hasn't been in a seance or through a medium. Again, there are real mediums and psychics, adn such, but also the majority are charlatans out to get your money and publicity.

I say send the magician "Criss Angel"" to confront him and show you how he does his trick. Angel always says it is slight of the hand. Hell, he even showed how he levitates. I would bet to say he can show up David Thompson . Come on Criss; take a dare and show this guy up, and show us how we are being taken.

And also, what is the reasoning to be behind a curtain?

Physical mediums often say they need to be in an enclosed space to concentrate their energy.

The fact that he is behind a curtain, where no one can possibly see him, is obviously, so that he can pull the wool over everyone eyes as he does his side show tricks.

Since the room is pitch black, it would make no difference if he was behind a curtain or not.

I would venture to say that there is a identical chair, that is dropped on the floor after the séance and Mr. Thompson silently runs to the chair afterwards.

The rooms are always searched and sealed, so there would be no opportunity to smuggle in a second chair.

Again, there are real mediums and psychics, and such, but also the majority are charlatans out to get your money and publicity.

That's probably true, but I'm no longer so sure David Thompson is one of the charlatans.

why don't we contact "Criss Angel". I know he would love the chance to show this guy up. If he couldn't show fraud then I believe it. Criss can get out of anything, and knows the tricks. Let's see if Thompson and Angel would be willing to do this. I can guarantee almost 100% angel would. He put Uri Geller to the test and he couldn't pass. Angel is always wanting to show the fraud in people. Like I said if anyone can show "con Artist" , "Fraud " he can.

If David is for real criss angel could be a danger to David Thompson.

Grabbing a medium or a manifestation in the middle of a séance could be dangerous to the medium.

Do we have the video of criss angel proving geller a fraud or do we have to take criss’s word for it.

Hi

I have known Natal the Maltese transfiguration medium. Through his face, in semi-darkness I could see faces of my beloved ones such as my aunt and I could see also faces of Red Indians with paintings on their faces, feathers and long hair. I could also see faces of women, men with beard or moustache. In the beginning i was skeptic, but now, I really do think that Natal is a very good transfiguration medium. Keep up the good work!

I agree with Caroline Lindsay that Criss Angel could be contacted to give support as an expert to examine David Thompson (and other mediums).

I don't know if Criss is easily reachable, but Michael P. once wrote that one of Criss's TV programm producers (a magician too) read this blog.

If Thompson isn't available, I think Zerdini could give us the names of some good current physical or materialisation mediums to be tested by Angel.

I think it's a good idea to examine under the most severe test conditions the claims of mediums. I guess that a real medium or psychics (e.g. Douglas Daniel Home or John Sloan) could provide good solid evidence under severe controlled experimental conditions.

If Angel gets a real medium, then is Angel who will have to admit that some mediums are real. If not, the fake medium will be exposed.

In cases of mediumship, I think the help of a trained magician/illusionist to make the test protocol is necessary to convince reasonable open-mind skeptics like most of us here.

I do not know any physical or materialization mediums at the present time that I would recommend with any confidence.

However, there is an alleged physical medium who is advertising on his website that he intends visiting the USA and Canada for five months from the end of September.

His name is Warren Caylor and you can see his website at:

http://www.warrencaylor.co.uk/

Maybe some readers of this blog may come across him in the near future. I believe he is visiting New York and also Toronto in Canada.

I would be very interested to hear your experiences if you come across him.

He recently backed out of a test seance, organised by the "Psychic News", at the last minute after agreeing to all the conditions laid down by the newspaper.

Warren Caylor has been caught in outright fraud on at least two occasions. See:
http://psychics.co.uk/psychic-forum/discussion/viewtopic.php?t=5051

He also charges huge $$$ for these shows.

The name I found in the Mormon Family History Centre in London was CADWELL, W C. If anyone doesn't believe me, go and look for yourself.

Thanks, Guy, for this information. It squares with what I'd already been told, but since there seemed to be some dispute about it, I couldn't be sure.

A couple of things I'd like to add:
1. Nobody asked me for money for the session I attended.
2. Nothing I saw or heard before, during or after it suggested any kind of fraud. I have compared notes with Magic Circle member James Webster, who attended a session similar to mine, and he had the same opinion although he is an expert in magic fake mediumship.
3.I gagged and tied David up myself, and I'm surprised his blood circulation survived. He took it all very calmly and generally struck me as a very nice and honest fellow. I've met lots of psychic conpersons and don't think he was one of them.
4.Somebody did some very impressive harmonica playing and then popped the instrument into my shirt pocket with no fumbling. Not easy to fake that.
5.Yes, the address of the Enfield poltergeist house is probably on the internet somewhere, but if "researchers' had found that, why couldn't they get my name right?

All that said, this isn't an area I want to stay in as it never seems to lead anywhere except a lot of nitpicking and inaccurate allegations from people with no direct experience of what they think they are debunking.

I do hope some kind of useful research can be done with David Thompson, who definitely has a place in my WFY file (Worth Follow Up)

With respect, I feel it necessary to ask Mr Playfair in what record did he find CADWELL, W.C. in the Morman Family History Centre in London?

It has been suggested that no record of a death of any William Cadwell, or W.C. Cadwell has been found in the official Government Death Index records in 1897 or in the two years prior or after that year. This fact too can be easily checked in any Morman Family History Centre anywhere in the world.

I do not wish to suggest that Mr Playfair is not telling us the truth I do feel that rather more information about what he found and in what record is really necessary, especially if he maintains that he has found evidence for the existence of Mr Thompson's main guide and friend that no one else seem able to find in any death or census records.

I would therefore appreciate Mr Playfair enlightening us on this matter.

Lis

Hi All,

I agree with Lis a few more facts may help as we appear to have a serious genealogical researcher at odds with a major psychic researcher (and other genealogists agree with her position). As this is one area of research which does not require David Thompsons involvement surely it will be easily resolved.

I have also seen all the substantiating evidence like the official government death records and all the family history material from the LDS(mormon family history centres) in which the information about William Cadwell is lacking. However, I am certain if Guy provides the documentary source and maybe age at and plus place of death it will help.

For interest anyone interested in Guy Lyon Playfair's history and achievements a simple google will give you the following immediate result.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guy_Lyon_Playfair
You will also find a good direct link to the Enfield Poltergeist. As Guy says so clearly (and Paul Barker indicated) David Thompson may be a worth following up but viable research is called for.

As Guy seems to have a direct line to the circle could he not persuaded David to reverse his 2002 position
http://www.cfpf.org.uk/letters/2002/2002-10-12_mr2dt.html
or his refusal to work with Prof Garry Schwartz at that time.

I do not think we are nit picking, Victor Zammit and David Thompson are making the most extaordinary claims about this mediumship. Surely in this case then some extra level of research and proof is needed. I think all of us who have been pursuing the facts have made it clear that this is why we see it as such an important issue.

One thing that may put me more at ease could Paul Barker confirm that none of the Haymist Circle knew how to or were learning the harmonica.

For the record here is a complete list of CADWELL deaths registered and recorded in the Government Record office Deaths Index between 1895 - 1900. The information includes the Quarter of the year in which the person died, their name, age at death, District in which death occurred and Volume and Page Reference.

1895
Jan - March Quarter - None
April - June Quarter - None

Jul - Sep Quarter - CADWELL
Beatrice 1 Luton V3b P246
Frank Andrew L 11 Wandsworth V1d P402
William 0 Burnely V8e P170

Oct - Dec Quarter CADWELL
Elizabeth 69 Redruth V5c P158

1896
Jan - March Quarter CADWELL
Elizabeth 50 Bolton V8c P294
John 57 Ormskirk V8b P552

Apr - June Quarter CADWELL
Enoch 78 Ormskirk V8b P499
John Stanley 1 Camberwell V1d P562

Jul - Sep Quarter CADWELL
Betty 0 Rochdale V8e P48
Ellen 42 Portsea V2b P301
Harry 0 Luton V3b P232

Oct - Dec Quarter CADWELL
Emily 71 St Saviour V1d P68
Gertrude Florence 6 Luton V3b P267
Peter 0 Ormskirk V8b P572

1897
Jan - March Quarter CADWELL
Caroline 66 Redruth V5c P168
James 51 Ormskirk V8b P537

Apr - June Quarter CADWELL
Edward 0 Whitehaven V10b P385

Jul - Sep Quarter CADWELL
Mary 46 Thame V8a P504

Oct - Dec Quarter CADWELL
Agnes 0 Rotherham V9c P403
Jane 5 Ormskirk V8b P567
Jane 4 Ormskirk V8b P540
Thomas 0 Burnely V8e P131

1898
Jan - March Quarter - None

Apr - June Quarter CADWELL
Jane Parker 16 Ormskirk V8b P542

Jul - Sep Quarter CADWELL
Ann 67 Ormskirk V8b P601
Betty Rimmer 0 Ormskirk V8b P617
Mary 0 Ormskirk V8b P614

Oct - Dec Quarter CADWELL
George William 0 Rotherham V9c P412
Robert 49 Rochdale V8e P19

1899
Jan - March Quarter CADWELL
Blanche 83 Redruth V5c P159
Sarah 66 Chesterfield V7b P472

Apr - June Quarter CADWELL
John 71 Ormskirk V8b P559

Jul - Sep Quarter CADWELL
Ernest Aubrey 0 Luton V3b P269
John 12 Wirral V8a P309
John 17 Ormskirk V8b P693

Oct - Dec Quarter CADWELL
Jane 0 Burnely V8e P132
Mary 84 Redruth V5c P150

1900
Jan - March Quarter - None

Apr - Jun Quarter CADWELL
Eliza Ellen 0 Hitchin V3a P326
Maria 1 Ormskirk V8b P581

Jul - Sep Quarter CADWELL
Ann 81 Ormskirk V8b P579

Oct - Dec Quarter CADWELL
John Carpenter 56 Leicester V7a P132

That is ALL the CADWELL DEATHS registered between 1895 and 1900.

I can supply actual images of all CADWELL deaths registered if you don't wish to take my word on this.

Since these are the only CADWELL deaths that have been recorded in the official deaths index I again ask Mr Playfair if he would be so kind as to provide us with the details of the record that he found.

Regards,

Lis


Guy Lyon Playfair wrote:

A couple of things I'd like to add:

1. “Nobody asked me for money for the session I attended.”

1.Completely irrelevant.

2. “Nothing I saw or heard before, during or after it suggested any kind of fraud. I have compared notes with Magic Circle member James Webster, who attended a session similar to mine, and he had the same opinion although he is an expert in magic fake mediumship.”

2. I know James Webster and would hardly describe him as an expert on “magic fake mediumship” He’s a magician like all magicians.

3.”I gagged and tied David up myself, and I'm surprised his blood circulation survived. He took it all very calmly and generally struck me as a very nice and honest fellow. I've met lots of psychic conpersons and don't think he was one of them.”

3. Also irrelevant.

4.”Somebody did some very impressive harmonica playing and then popped the instrument into my shirt pocket with no fumbling. Not easy to fake that.”

4. Who did the harmonica belong to? What was it doing in the séance room?

5.”Yes, the address of the Enfield poltergeist house is probably on the internet somewhere, but if "researchers' had found that, why couldn't they get my name right?”

5. That is a question you should ask David Thompson!

“All that said, this isn't an area I want to stay in as it never seems to lead anywhere except a lot of nitpicking and inaccurate allegations from people with no direct experience of what they think they are debunking.”

No-one is debunking anything - we are simply asking questions which no-one seems able to answer. Neither is it nitpicking nor are the allegations inaccurate.

“I do hope some kind of useful research can be done with David Thompson, who definitely has a place in my WFY file (Worth Follow Up)”

I agree as long as suitable protocols are followed.


On the old Spiritualist Chat Room site (transferred to the new SCR I understand) the suggestion was made that the information Mr Playfair had found was actually for a William CALDWELL who had died in 1898 or 1899.

Mr Playfair has on this thread made it clear

"The name I found in the Mormon Family History Centre in London was CADWELL, W C. If anyone doesn't believe me, go and look for yourself"

Nevertheless, in order that there be no uncertainty (some might think that William Charles CADWELL just might have been incorrectly recorded under the CALDWELL surname) I provide below a list of all William CALDWELL'S whose death were registered between 1895 - 1900. The CALDWELL name is significantly more common than that of CADWELL.

1895
Jan - March Quarter CALDWELL
William 56 W. Derby 8b 405 (b. 1839)

Apr - June Quarter CALDWELL
Henry William 3 Newcastle T 10b 84

Jul - Sep Quarter - no William's

Oct - Dec Quarter CALDWELL
William 0 W. Derby 8b 227

1896
Jan - March Quarter - no William's

Apr - June Quarter CALDWELL
William James 72 Marylebone 1a 386 (b. 1824)

Jul - Sep Quarter CALDWELL
William 40 W. Derby 8b 328 (b. 1856)

Oct - Dec Quarter CALDWELL
Wallace William 0 Newport M. 11a 127

1897
Jan - March Quarter CALDWELL
William Reginald 4 Toxteth Park 8b 180

Apr - Jun Quarter CALDWELL
William 76 Warrington 8c 125 (b. 1821)

Jul - Sep Quarter CALDWELL
William 55 Barrow F. 8e 583 (b. 1842)
William 87 Portsea 2b 319 (b. 1810)

Oct - Dec Quarter CALDWELL
William 57 W. Derby 8b 413 (b. 1840)
William 0 Warrington 8c 137

1898
Jan - March Quarter CALDWELL
William 67 Lambeth 1d 195 (b. 1831)

Apr - Jun Quarter - no William's

Jul - Sep Quarter - no William's

Oct - Dec Quarter - no William's

1899
Jan - March Quarter CALDWELL
William 62 Prestwich 8d 554 (b. 1837)

Apr - Jun Quarter CALDWELL
William 67 Leigh 8c 137 (b. 1832)
William 26 Newcastle T 10b. 51 (b. 1873)

Jul - Sep Quarter CALDWELL
William 59 W. Derby 8b 544 (b. 1840)

Oct - Dec Quarter - no William's

1900
Jan - March Quarter CALDWELL
William 73 Prestwich 8d 358 (b. 1827)
William 71 Lutterworth 7a 3 (b. 1829)

Apr - Jun Quarter CALDWELL
William 69 Toxteth Park 8b 201 (b. 1831)
William George 45 Holborn 1b 409 (b. 1855)

Jul - Sep Quarter CALDWELL
William 0 Runcorn 8a 135

Oct - Dec Quarter CALDWELL
William 0 Oldham 8d 482

May I point out that none of these CALDWELL William's are William Charles. None lived in London and none died in London area in 1897. I have also tracked all these William CALDWELL through the census records and established that they did not live in London area, and were not "a man of science" nor involved in publishing of scientific material. None were incorrectly recorded as CALDWELL on the Death Registration Index but previously recorded in census data as CADWELL.

The same applies to all the William CADWELL'S that are recorded. They can all be tracked through the various census records between 1841 and 1901. No William Charles, or W.C. or William CADWELL fitting the information provided by "William Charles CADWELL" - Mr Thompson's guide - can be found in the census records.

It is for this reason that I am so interested in what Mr Playfair has apparently found at the London Morman Family History Centre. Especially since there is no IGI record, no Ancestral File record and no other submission or extract Birth, Death or Marriage, on the Morman Family History website relating to a William Charles Cadwell, or W.C. Cadwell.

Please help us out here Mr Playfair in the interests of research. I understand that you are a serious investigator and so feel sure that you would have available the details of the record you found.

Regards,

Lis

Just a point to show how easy it is to find out about people, especially well known ones. Really before Guy Lyon Playfair mentioned James Webster I knew little about him or his involvement with the Scole Experiments (which I know David Thompson is fascinated by and whilst with us tried to link himself to in a way that I now forget because it was so obscure)

Seems quite appropriate in such a subject to find a link to him from Simon Forsyths Psychic Times, a paper which Victor Zammit is so incandescent about, to James Webster.

Just scroll to the bottom of the page
http://www.thepsychictimes.com/links2.htm

You may also wish to refresh yourself on the Allan Crossley controversy, with Victor and David, while you are there and the 1,000 pound challenge.

alternatively that page takes you to
http://www.jamesw.clara.net/

So you all know who Guy Lyon Playfair and James Webster are, if you did not before. Took a few minutes.

Playfair wrote:

"The name I found in the Mormon Family History Centre in London was CADWELL, W C. If anyone doesn't believe me, go and look for yourself."

I did go and look for myself at five years before and after 1897 and did not find a W.C. Cadwell.

So come on Playfair- produce the evidence of your statement.

When I get a spare afternoon I'll go round to the FHC and check whether I was hallucinating last time.

Hi Guy,

Thanks for that - I do hope that you will find to visit the FHC soon - and hopefully you were not "hallucinating last time"!

I really am a serious researcher and have been a genaeologist for over 10 years but I am always willing to accept new evidential information if someone is able to provide it. (if this site had smiley's I would put one in here).

Seriously, I do hope that if there is information that contradicts the Death Index records you can share it with us. The issue of David Thompson's guide is an important one. So much of what goes on in his seances relies on the intregrity of this entity and to substantiate, if possible, his existence, since the entity himself places so much reliance on his existence 1830 -1897, would certainly help to resolve one of the issues around David Thompson's mediumship.

Regards,

Lis

In view of the passions Mr Cadwell still seems to arouse, I went through my 2003 notebook and found this for December:

'Mormon FHC: William Charles Cadwell, b. 1843 London. Only one'. [meaning no other Cadwells on file]

I didn't note date of death which I should have, and next time I'm down that way I'll pop in and check.

Thank you.

.....you may also care to answer my previously posed question viz:

4.”Somebody did some very impressive harmonica playing and then popped the instrument into my shirt pocket with no fumbling. Not easy to fake that.”

4. Who did the harmonica belong to? What was it doing in the séance room?

Z

Thank you for clarifying what information you had found Guy. I can further enlighten you on the William Charles Cadwell you have mentioned.

He was in fact born on Aug 4 1842 in St Martins in the Fields, the son of William Andrew Cadwell and Ann Adam. His father was a Waterman and W.C. was not actually christened until a year after his birth, on 2 Aug 1843 at St Martins.

In 1861 (at Census time) this William Charles Cadwell was residing at 3 Brewer St Chelsea with his parents. He was recorded as being 18 and a Gilder by occupation.

Sadly, this William Charles Cadwell died at the age of 23 in the December Quarter of 1865 (GRO Deaths Dec Q 1865 Chelsea 1a 141). His father William Andrew Cadwell died aged 59 in 1870 (Dec Q 1870 Chelsea 1a 172).

It is obvious that this William Charles Cadwell is not the "etherean" who claims to be William Charles CADWELL born 1830 died 1897.

It would seem that this supposed entity did not have the physical life they claim and this gives rise to serious concerns about the validity of the apparent communications from this "William Charles Cadwell".

I am grateful to you for being so honest and providing the information you discovered and for confirming there was no other one in the records.

Back on Sep 27 2007 David Thompson wrote on the SCR, when referring to his various guides:

"my main friend and contact is: William Charles Cadwell, who passed in 1897. (William was check up by the SPR when Monty Keen did his report into my mediumship and was found)."

Subsequently, when the statement which appeared to suggest Montegue Keen had found 'Cadwell', was challenged, and Keen's wife confirmed he had not searched for this information, David Thompson then claimed that it was you who had done the research and had confirmed that his 'guide' William Charles Cadwell had been born 1830 and died 1897.

Clearly, the brief piece of information on the existence of a W. C. Cadwell noted by you does not do that.

I can state that in 2006 Mr Thompson, when a guest at our Spiritualist organization informed me directly that evidence of Cadwell's life and death had been found and had confirmed his earthly existence.

It is obvious that this was not the case.

Regards,

Lis

In early December 2007, I wrote to Victor Zammit, in part to advize him that after "extensive research, including examination of death records, census records" I felt certain that no William Charles Cadwell had died in 1897 nor in the years prior or after.

I pointed out to Mr Zammit the census records show that there were at any time between 1841 and 1901 only a dozen or less people with the name William Cadwell living in the UK. None lived in areas which would produce the 'home counties' accent displayed by Mr Thompson 'guide' William.

I also informed Mr Zammit that I had searched for evidence for an existence of Timothy Booth, another of Thompson's seance 'guides' who, it is claimed by Thompson, was born in 1899 in London and died in the same area in 1908.

I confirmed that no one by the name of Timothy Booth was born in 1899 anywhere in the UK and also that no such person died in 1908 anywhere in England.

Mr Zammit did reply to my correspondence, however, he took the rather odd precaution of heading his response PRIVATE & CONFIDENTIAL so I may not quote from his reply.

Nevertheless, much of what Mr Zammit wrote, he has conveyed elsewhere on other occasions and so it is available to me to say that Mr Zammit appears not to be worried that William Charles Cadwell's or Timothy Booth's or the details of any other member of the spirit team, or those who purport to attend such as Louis Armstrong, Arthur Conan Doyle, Ghandi, etc, have not been or cannot be objectify validated.

Indeed, objective validation that they are who they claim to be is, apparently, not important. The identity of any transmitting entity is certainly less important as far as Mr Zammit is concerned than the information passed on by these objectively unconfirmed entities.

I personally find this view rather puzzling. The whole purpose of materialisation phenomena is to provide incontrovertible evidence of survival over physical death. To do that requires the existence of a person who provably had a physical life, who has died, returns in the seance room and via direct voice, or other forms of verbal communication, or via materialisation of a ectoplasmic facsimile of their previous physical body, demonstrates identifiable, convincing evidence that they are who they say they are.

It is not sufficient, in a totally darkened room for a disembodied voice to claim they are Willliam Charles Cadwell, or Louis Armstrong, Ghandi, Doyle, etc., and yet fail to provide any information that can confirm their identity.

It is not sufficient, in a totally darkened room to claim that a 'materialised' spirit person is moving around the room, unseen by anyone. To claim that such is actually 'materialisation' taking place is totally at odds with what materialisation is actually about. Nothing is being proved regarding survival.

Regards,
Lis

I am glad that we have got to the bottom of the real facts about the supposed life of William Charles Cadwell David Thompsons main guide and the convenor of his “spirit team” born 1830 died 1897 a Londoner and man of science. With Guy Lyon Playfair’s help we know that the final apparent claim of his existence has been disproved.

This gives a very serious problem because David is promoted as the most important living medium proving survival, by both COSC and Victor Zammit. Yet the main guide and “spirit” convening all events has told David something that is not true. Timothy Booth did not exist either, his life does not appear in the official UK birth and death records. We also know back in 2003 Psychic Times reported on a séance at Cober Hill where Timothy said he knew William in the physical yet gave a birth date subsequently several years after Williams claimed death date.

Given his record in not being who he says we must have much greater concern about what he says. William has said things which are incorrect, hurtful and could be downright dangerous. Séance recordings show William recommending that pregnant women, who may be concerned about Downs Syndrome, should take Aspirin once they know they are pregnant to help prevent it. Any medical practioner will tell you that a genetic defect cannot be prevented after conception and Aspirin is dangerous to pregnant women except in specific medically controlled states. William also told of a direct link between AIDS and Downs Syndrome, something obviously incorrect and hurtful to many.

William is also the convenor for all the guest spirits even the psychic surgeon. Now Paul Barker has confirmed that, at that same Cober Hill event, Dr S the surgeon told a cancer patient he did not have cancer although she died of cancer two weeks later. He also told a woman who recently had a breast removed for cancer she should not have had the operation. We can also give instances of events from his appearance for us in Adelaide.

William also brings the celebrities “fru”. If you go to my forum here http://spiritualismlink.forumotion.com/physical-mediumship-f5/the-curious-case-of-david-thompson-and-victor-zammit-t132-15.htm
You can listen to some voice comparisons of various “people”. You can also check Simon Forsyth’s Psychic Times re Allan Crossley here http://www.thepsychictimes.com/zammit.htm
I am not even going to Louis Armstrong, any man who would say “that trumpet comes first, before anything, even my wife” would materialise his instrument (physical mediumship records show this has happened Z may add extra light) rather than play the harmonica. Either that or he would do some “Heebie Jeebies” style scat a method of singing which he created. There are also many intricate questions that could be asked as there are some wonderful snippets of odd information about him. However as with all the “visitors” minimum questions are asked by all the circle members.

So if William and Timothy are not real as they have claimed what weight can we put on what they supposedly produce in the séance room especially when all of this occurs in the dark.

Thanks Guy Lyon Playfair for sharing the brief research you did, which I am sure you never intended to be used n the way it has. Maybe you will agree that given the nature of the claims made for David it is time he agreed to undergo scientific research to validate his mediumship if possible

Hi Michael,

May I draw your attention to comments made in your statement at the top of this thread?

You wrote:
"When questions arose about the reality of Thompson's purported spirit control, a certain William C. Cadwell, Playfair did some research in Mormon family history records and apparently found there was a William C. Cadwell who died within one year of the date of death given by Thompson's "William." There seems to be some question as to whether the person Playfair uncovered was named Cadwell or Caldwell. (As I am told Guy Playfair sometimes reads this blog, perhaps he can be prevailed upon to clear this up.)* Moreover, some people say it couldn't be Thompson's "William" because the spirit control claimed to have come from London and the person listed in the Mormon records lived in a different part of England. According to my correspondent, however, the Mormon records did not list Cadwell/Caldwell's place of origin. In any event, there does appear to be at least some support for the existence of a William C. Cadwell/Caldwell in the appropriate timeframe."

Subsequently, you added:

"[*Update, September 12: In the comments thread (below), Guy Lyon Playfair confirms that the name he found in the Mormon records was W. C. Cadwell.]"

With respect, might I suggest that it would now be appropriate, indeed, vitally important, that you insert into your original statement a further correction which conveys the true state of affairs with regard to this aspect of Mr Thompson's purported 'control' and his mediumship.

Mr Playfair has now clarified for us all that the Cadwell W.C. that he discovered was not born in 1830, and he did not establish a date of death for this person. Also that his note to himself makes clear he did not find any other William Charles Cadwell.

This, coupled with the fact that others have clearly established there are no records supportive of the existence of Mr Thompson's 'control' and that Thompson's claims Playfair and the SPR had done so, are entirely erroneous, is of such significance that to do other than enter this into your original statement would result in a misrepresentative picture of the situation.

Many people view your blog, however, this thread is now long and many issues have been raised. It is your primary statement that will influence many people and your present insertion which appears to support the validity of "William" may result in many not bothering to read on through all the subsequent discussion. In other words the truth may remain obscured.

In the interests of fairness and the important need for the real facts to be made clear I hope that you will correct the current situation as soon as possible.

It would also seem appropriate to advise your correspondent of the correct facts now made available.

Regards,
Lis

Michael,

I am saddened that you have not made any response to my comments. Whatever you find yourself believing about the mediumship of David Thompson, the fact that both his 'main control' and the purported guide who is claimed to be an "expert in producing the ectoplasm" have clearly been shown not to have existed as they, and David Thompson, claim.

We should not hide this fact away but openly acknowledge it if the question of Thompson's mediumship is to be honestly and fairly evaluated.

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