The rainbow bridge

Going through some family papers, I came across a pamphlet provided by a crematorium that disposed of the remains of my parents' dog about ten years ago. What interested me about the pamphlet was how strongly it showed the influence of Spiritualism, a religious movement often regarded as almost totally extinct.

Though Spiritualism clearly was a stronger cultural force a hundred years ago than it is now, it does seem to have made a lasting impression in some quarters. Possibly NDEs also factor in to the viewpoint presented in this pamphlet. Much of the material is quite consistent with channeled communications from the heyday of trance mediumship, and with NDEs that include a description of a heavenly realm. 

The only element that doesn't seem grounded in such reports is the "rainbow bridge" itself, which as far as I know has not been described by either mediums or NDErs. 

Here's the pamphlet in its entirety: 

The Rainbow Bridge

Because of its many colors, the bridge connecting Heaven and Earth has come to be known as the Rainbow Bridge.

Just this side of the Bridge, there is a land of meadows, hills and lush green valleys. When a beloved pet dies, this wonderful place serves as their new home. There is always an abundance of food and water and warm sunshine. Old and frail animals are young again, and those who have been maimed are made whole. They make new friends and play all day. 

There is one thing missing from these carefree surroundings, though - the companionship of their loving masters. Time passes and soon another day comes when one of them is distracted by a familiar scent. With nose twitching, ears at attention and eyes staring in delight, this one runs from the group …

YOU have been seen!

As you embrace, your face is kissed again and again and again, and once more you look into the eyes of your loyal companion.

You cross the Rainbow Bridge together, never again to be separated.

We Can Only Hope …

 

Comments

[Matt Rouge]

Interesting post, Michael. Rainbow bridge from Norse mythology, perhaps? Yes, I have never heard that being described as "real."

[XXII]

It's a rather strange worldview for me to consider. I cannot imagine that a dog wiggling its tail for eternity, making new friends and pissing on everlasting lamposts.

[zerdini]

The inspiration for the poem is generally acknowledged to come from an ancient Norse legend. Bifrost, the rainbow bridge was a bridge the gods used to travel to and from earth, and where worthy Norse warriors crossed to Valhalla.

The poem has been on the internet for many years with 'author unknown' although at least three people claim to have written it.

There is sufficient evidence through mediumship that animals, like humans, survive death.

[Douglas]

Spiritualism may often be regarded as extinct but it seems to be alive and well.

[XXII]

But what exactly is the nature of that survival? I have a hard time thinking that by chance an entity is bound to be a dog for all eternity, whilst another an ant, whilst another a human being.

Its rather problematic, actually. I have not come a cross a metaphysical formulation that takes into account the nature of survival for other 'life forms'.

[jshgfcre98ijyds]

I think the higher animals retain identity after death. Individual human spirits are said to continue to evolve into higher and higher entities over the ages after they pass beyond the earth plane. Why should not animals do something similar. We tend to have an anthropocentric view of the universe. The path for the development of the human soul is not necessarily the only path or even the most important path.

[jshgfcre98ijyds]

"I have not come a cross a metaphysical formulation that takes into account the nature of survival for other 'life forms'."

See Alan Kardac's The Spirit's Book Chapter XI.

[Bryan.A]

I've seen medium's describe certain spheres for pets.Dogs and Horses being the most common,but never a rainbow bridge.
When you cross compare that with other info such as humans frequenting different spheres,darkness to light to make it simple it wouldn't make much sense to suggest a "rainbow bridge" sphere for animals.

I'd say certain animals would have their own sphere of existence,that is if they're not in their own reincarnation cycle(what did you think only humans reincarnate?)

Speculative offcourse,but understanding the afterlife for us humans is already very hard,understanding it with a high degree of confidence for animals is quite harder.

[Jason Wingate]

Of course spiritualism is alive and well -- all the mediums in the world are practicing it.

It also influences a lot of modern OBE pracitioners. The influence is very strong in Brasil -- check out Waldo Vieira, who is not as well-known in English as he should be.

In his excellent OBE opus Astral Dynamics, Robert Bruce (who was also very influenced by spiritualist connections) mentions a level he reached in OBE which instantly reminded him of the legendary Rainbow Bridge.

[XXII]

The issue is that Im not persuaded that lifeforms of higher order express a mind so complex that it could engage in the kind of afterlife often envisioned. That is, one that arises from the coceptual, propositional, creative, imaginative, allegorical faculties that the human mind is known to exhibit.

If this is not the case, im not sure what the cause or substrate of any 'shared reality' afterlife would be for animals.

The very idea that there is a sphere for every specie seems convulted and I dont see if there is any kind of evidence that, prima facie, suggests that such division is in order.

Furthermore, even if one would grant that, how would the community of dog-minds elicit a somewhat objective (in relation to the subjects of experience, not as material objects per se) reality?

On the same line, bats probably dont 'see the light' for their surviving minds, were they to actually survive, would carry the habits of their batly life.. and I dont think they're very fond of light.

[Juan]

My position is based on the transmission theory: consciousness is fundamental in the universe, but consciousness could only manifest in the material sphere when began to emerge the first living creatures with nervous systems. So when more complex the nervous system, more individual and complex consciousness will manifest. Thus, all conscious beings would have a form of afterlife evolved toward greater complexity, individuality and personality.

[Art]

There is only one mind, one consciousness, and we are each one of us a facet of that consciousness. We are all limited as to what we know. Our consciousness here on this earth, compared to the "higher mind", is like a drop of water compared to the ocean.

[jshgfcre98ijyds]

"My position is based on the transmission theory: consciousness is fundamental in the universe, but consciousness could only manifest in the material sphere when began to emerge the first living creatures with nervous systems. "

Are you saying consciousness manifesting in a living creature is a natural phenomena and is not mediated/organized/coordinated by intelligent entities?

If it is not a natural phenomena presumably it is mediated by advanced/intelligent beings. How did they develop?

I think there must have been a way for complex intelligences to develop in the absence of living creatures with nervous systems.

If you consider, for example, what NDE'ers say, it seems like incarnation is coordinated by advanced beings. NDE'rs are asked if they want to go back finish their life etc. It seems that there is some intelligent coordination involved in the process of an disembodied consciousness incarnating in a living creature (human being).

Maybe there is a natural way for intelligence to develop but why assume it is on the earth plane. It could be that in the spirit plane or at some higher level it developed naturally.

[Leo]

I would say that other animals also survive death like dog and cats etc. The question is how far does it go down too. Do ants and bees have souls?.

[Art]

"I would say that other animals also survive death like dog and cats etc. The question is how far does it go down too. Do ants and bees have souls?." - Leo
--------------------------------------------

There's not really "souls" - only "soul." One consciousness. We here in the physical universe can't begin to comprehend or understand the feelings of oneness and connectedness in heaven. All connected to the source. As a metaphor think of it like the holodeck on the Star Ship Enterprise and the whole thing being generated by the ship's computer.

"I remember understanding the others here.. as if the others here were a part of me too. As if all of it was just a vast expression of me. But it wasn't just me, it was .. gosh this is so hard to explain.. it was as if we were all the same. As if consciousness were like a huge being. The easiest way to explain it would be like all things are all different parts of the same body." - excerpt from Michelle M's NDE, http://nderf.org/michelle_m%27s_nde.htm

[XXII]

But art, then there is no individuality. You cannot reconcile this idea of one indiscriminate consciousness with the notion of personal survival. You might say that we're all connected and that individuality is a bit 'washed down'.. but that is very clearly a different notion than that of 'one consciousness'

[Art]

What oh! What did I do! Turned on the italics and didn't turn them off! See if this works.

Sorry! I can't seem to get them to turn off.

[Art]

"I was unique yet I was the tiniest part of the whole." - excerpt from Mark Horton's NDE, http://www.mindspring.com/~scottr/nde/markh.html
-------------------------------------------

No, by experiencing separation in this life it teaches the soul what it means and how it feels to be separate, something it can't learn on the other side. Once the soul learns about separateness it is able to maintain that sense of individuality and uniqueness. It's the whole purpose of this life and why we have to experience so much separation in this life.

[Art]

I guess putting several html tags to turn off italics worked? Whew! that was embarassing.

[Juan]

I think the development of consciousness and intelligence is easier on the material rather than spiritual plane. Why reincarnation would happen, to meet new obstacles and resistances that make us progress. Obstacles hardly be found in the spiritual plane.

[Bryan.A]

"In his excellent OBE opus Astral Dynamics, Robert Bruce (who was also very influenced by spiritualist connections) mentions a level he reached in OBE which instantly reminded him of the legendary Rainbow Bridge."

Unless the OBE has a veridical aspect to it I don't think each and every OBE is the experience of the afterlife.When you are able to WILD(wake initiated lucid dream) at will you will see that that many aspects of the OBE differ from an NDE.That's not to say "some" aspects might be psi related,but I do think the vast majority of whatever is experienced is a very..very lucid lucid dream.Evidence I have?Offcourse not,but I had at least 100 recorded LD's,~10 very clear WILD obe's and participated in a shared dreaming project.

If Psi is able to manifest itself during waking consiousness,why not during sleeping consiousness when supposedly we are closer to the astral consiousness?Just like in real life this does not mean every participant with supposed abilities is able to do so especially as pure as an NDE in which there is no brain activity.

As for animals in the afterlife spheres,i've read mediumistic accounts of birds in the higher spheres.

Supposedly some birds are the most evolved form of animal on the planet hence they are also in the higher spheres together with Humans.

As for what life forms reincarnate?
To put it simple,the first dying cel of the human somehow lead to the cel of what was to be an ape.Obviously the evolution of the human cel was not as homo sapien or even fishlike.

After this many other life forms split from the cels of the ape-cel,which in turn after many millions(billions?) of years led to evolution of various different cel life forms,many of these creatures for instance bugs and what not did not continue to reincarnate,from cel->fish form->half sea,half land form,->land based,im sure I missed many steps,but to dumb it down,after which dino's which reinarnated many times with their evolution to become the cow and many other landbased creatures and what not we see today,some forms of dino's into Birds we see in our skies,all progressive with the biological evolution and progress of consiousness of each individual lifeform.Animals only into animals being they got their own category in evolution,and humans a different kind of evolution across the planet.

At the end of the chain stands the homo sapien,that would be us,the birds,horses,dog's and who knows monkeys,those creatures with the highest consiousness on earth are also the creatures appearing most in the mediumistic afterlife sphere,coincidence?I think not.Still speculation though XD

[Bryan.A]

My apologizies,I confused ants reincarnation with ant's in the afterlife sphere.I would say only the very highest consiousness reincarnated animals would frequent the afterlife spheres.Hence a reason why an ant could reincarnate but not frequent the afterlife.As to what Laws determine this?Good luck figuring out the exact modus operandi of reincarnation tied to biological evolution of animals.With humans as we know from so many different species(not races) is very complex.

[Ginny]

From the afterlife accounts I have read so far, I have found descriptions of wild animals and birds - but not dogs, cats and horses "over there". Why would the afterlife include wild animals who are strangers to us, and not the beloved pets who were our dear friends on this side of the veil?

On the other hand, one could argue that immortality makes sense for humans, who are presumably capable of infinite moral growth and progression. But what would the point be for an animal? Other than to keep us company, of course, because we love them. But would we "outgrow" them in some eons of time?

[jshgfcre98ijyds]

"From the afterlife accounts I have read so far, I have found descriptions of wild animals and birds - but not dogs, cats and horses "over there"."

Then you haven't read enough afterlife accounts. Pets do survive. I've read accounts of pets surviving and also been in mediumship classes where pets came through ( a dog in one and a parrot in another). In both cases more than one student perceived the pet spirit.

[zerdini]

At a séance with Mrs Etta Wriedt (the famous direct voice medium), a sitter was told by the medium's guide: " 'There's a horse here belonging to one of you,' at which there was a laugh.

"The guide, with some asperity, said, 'You may laugh, but let me tell you that people here have their horses, dogs and pets. Ah! you little know the spirit world.' . . ."

In his booklet “Animals in the Spirit World”, Harold Sharp (who was a good friend of mine) wrote:

"When I was six years old we had a dog named Hector. A big lumbering dog.

It knocked me over many times and then would tug at my jacket trying to pull me up again.

If he had been a man instead of a dog I fear that he might well have become a drunkard. I never knew a dog with such a thirst.

He seemed to thrive on drinking.

Every bucket of water, puddle of water, the water in the horses' drinking troughs, dripping taps and if none of these were available he would pull at my mother's skirt and draw her towards the pump.

Hector had been 'dead' for twenty years.

I had almost forgotten his existence until one evening in a physical circle, at the home of Glover Botham in Golders Green, Hector, in full view of everybody, materialised.

There was a large blue china bowl of water on the floor in the centre of the circle as this is thought sometimes to add power to aid various manifestations.

The materialised Hector, unmindful of the purpose for which the water was supplied, set to and very noisily lapped up the whole of it. Then he barked loudly as though to say, 'Wasn't that clever.'

Later we heard that his bark had been heard by the two ladies living next door."

Mr Sharp continues with an interesting account of the return of a bird:

"At about the same time I was at another séance when a lovely blue-green budgerigar materialised in a room, which was in strong red light.

There were eight people present.

Gradually a blue-green mist began to move over the sitters' heads and from this ectoplasmic formation there flew a budgerigar.

It circled around the room then settled on a man's shoulder. He had owned the bird two years previously but it had been 'killed' by a cat.

It evidently recognised its owner, for in a very clear voice – as though appealing to him it said, 'I want a cigarette.'

This made everyone laugh.

It appears that its owner was a chain-smoker and had so often made this remark that the budgie had learned to mimic him."

[Bruce Siegel]

I woke up this morning and visited CNN.com to see what's happening in the world. The biggest headline on the page read: "Bidding Farewell from Beyond the Grave?"

It's an article on crisis apparitions:
http://www.cnn.com/2011/09/23/living/crisis-apparitions/index.html?hpt=hp_c1

The most amazing part: in this long piece, only a single sentence discusses a possible non-paranormal explanation.

[XXII]

Yeah. Well.. I can only say that I wish Im able to someday experience something as conclusive as what you told, Zerdini.

I admit that it seems weird to me. The main issue is that if dogs mantain the scope or what we presume to be the extent of their mindful life, then we should assume that someone that is severly discapacitated, with something like mental retardation, would continue to be a retard in the afterlife.

If you then say that upon death the 'constrains' of the brain which cause this retardation are no longer existant, then upon the death of the dog shouldnt one expect its mindful life to be considerably expanded. If this is the case, why does it continue to be percieved as a dog, a horse, a bird, in the afterlife, to the point of materializing as one?

For isnt the difference between us and other animals the extent to which or brain is able to either produce, in a materialist metaphysics, or transmit/filter/etc, on a dualist metaphysics, conscious activity? Why would there be such a division in the afterlife, if the division would seem to arise mainly from the conditions of the 'material sphere'?

Im honestly curious.

[Art]

I've read NDEs where they said they were able to talk to their pets. I think the stuff that limits us in this life disappears in the next. At least that's the feeling I get from reading lots and lots of NDE's, death bed visions, mystical and transcendental experiences, and watching some Mediums work.

What limits us are out physical bodies and in the next life, while we may have a physical body if we choose to, I get the feeling that it's not a permanent thing but more of a "when you want to" sort of thing?

[jshgfcre98ijyds]

You have to consider the characteristics of the spirit's mind and the characteristics of the physical brain. In the case of a retarded person, the physical brain is limiting the capacities of the spirit mind. After death those physical constraints are no longer present and the spirit will experince it's full capacity of a normal spirit mind.

In the case of a small animal you would probably have a more limited mind to start with so that after death the capabilities of the spirit might be similar to those of the incarnated animal.

Usually after death, for a time at least, the individual has a spirit body that matches the earth body of the previous incarnation. This is to prevent psychological shock. It initial experience in the afterlife is as similar to the physical life as possible. If an animal incarnated as a poodle, in the afterlife they would have a spirit body of a healthy poodle in the prime of it's life.

However I don't think the poodle would continue to incarnate as a poodle throughout eternity just as the spirit of a human does not continue to incarnate as a human on earth for ever and ever. After some number of lives they would graduate to more advanced lessons and different types of physical or etheric bodies.

[zerdini]

Silver Birch: "There is individual survival for domestic animals that have had positive association with humans. Thus they have been helped to achieve an individual evolution that is not possible with animals who are still in a group soul, or soul group, even on earth. It is part of the wonderful relationship that can exist between humans and animals, each helping the other to develop spiritually. You help the animal that comes into your surroundings to achieve a consciousness that is more personal and individual that it otherwise would have been. It is that which survives death. But where there is not this more evolved 'human' expression it joins the soul group or group soul."

[XXII]

Yeah, but that's what Im saying. We say that an ant has a more limited mind because thats what we see in nature, but this is decidedly on the material sphere, where such thing to exist. Discarded the brain, I dont see how any mind could be more limited than any other mind, especially if you bring down the barriers that constrain knowledge. Couldnt the limited mind of the spirit ant tap into universal knowledge, such that it wouldnt make any sense to call it a limited mind?

Zerdini: Sorry, it just seems like an unjustified separation of the human from the rest of nature. We are animals, you know? At least in our body.

[Roger Knights]

Here's what's coming up tonight on Coast to Coast radio:

tonight's show
1am - 5am ET
10pm - 2am PT
Shared Death Experiences
Sun 09-25

Near-death experience expert, Raymond Moody, joins George Knapp to discuss shared death experiences - deathbed moments when entire families see the light, the room changes shape, or everyone is witness to a film-like review of a loved one's life, giving us a new understanding of the journey that we will take at the end of our lives.

[Juan]

I believe that while the minds of animals and human beings after biological death are enhanced, every mind is still limited by his past, if it was an ant, a human, a dolphin. But these limits are not fixed because throught successive reincarnations a mind is being developed more complex and evolving from one species to another such as being precise.

[.]

Here's what's coming up tonight on Coast to Coast radio:

You are so lucky in America to have this show. I love it.

[Bryan.A]

"Couldnt the limited mind of the spirit ant tap into universal knowledge, such that it wouldnt make any sense to call it a limited mind?"

You assume ant's are able to experience an afterlife sphere.

What if this was not the case(as I assume it to be)

Then your limited mind issue problem is nonexistent for ants at least.

As for birds and dogs,from the accounts i've read in the afterlife sphere when elevated to a higher sphere of light they have a higher consiousness then it would have while on earth with physical restraints and urges.

For instance,birds automatically fly to you on your arm to welcome you into the sphere of light while singing their most beautiful song.Telepathy goes both ways with animals and humans.They can feel what you feel in the afterlife and so you can experience their consiousness as well when the connection is made.

I don't see many birds doing that by themselves here on earth.So expanded consiousness of animals in the spheres of light is a possibility I suppose,but how expanded is anyone's guess.

[Paul]

XXII

I may be wrong here but your thought that a dog suddenly might expand its consciousness when it pops off seems to assume that 'consciousness' comes in one size. Is it possible that it doesn't? That consciousness may expand in a natural way but that we don't all have an equal serving of it? Or maybe it comes in 'dog size' and 'horse size' and 'human size'? :)

It would appear that even humans, after death don't suddenly have a massive, or even significant, increase in their consciousness. They appear to be exactly what they were before they died. Change does seem to come for them, but not rapidly.

[Michelle @ Hollywood Psychics]

I know that many who follow the Wiccian or Pagan beliefs discuss the Rainbow Bridge as the path to the Summerlands or afterlife.

[Michael Prescott]

I agree with Paul, and am not sure why anyone would assume that all consciousnesses are the same. Suppose instead of "consciousness" we say "soul." Isn't it entirely possible, even likely, that every soul is different, in fact unique? That not only are animal souls different from human souls, but my soul is different from yours? The alternative is that all souls are just parts of an undifferentiated, amorphous, identity-less cosmic blob of pure awareness. Where's the fun in that?

[Art]

That's what it starts out as, just like we were once part of our parent's DNA. Then we come to earth and experience separation and learn what it means and how it feels to be separate and that imprints on the soul and it becomes a separate, unique, individual. I think it has a whole lot to do with "why we are here."

[Roger Knights]

"You are so lucky in America to have this show. I love it."

Subscribers worldwide can listen to live and archived broadcasts over the Internet. You can subscribe by clicking links at the top of the third column of the site, here: http://www.coasttocoastam.com/

[XXII]

Yeah Art but I dont think that the human being is the last chain in the spiritual evolution process. I mean, I suppose people say that animals would reincarnate, continously expanding its native consciousness through sucessive incarnations. I say, then, that the same would happen with us humans.

You see, what Im trying to fit in is the phenomena that constitutes the 'material shpere'. I think that Michael and others would be more generous to the idea that reincarnation (here, or elsewhere) is part of the picture. I suppose that you subscribe to the view that you will continue to be Art ad infinitum, as would an ant. But on that view, why wouldnt a retard be a retard ad infinitum?

The person who you think to be yourself is only known as it can manifest through the brain you are endowed with, so that your survival could potentially be as something that is completely different from the 'you' that you think you are.

Also, the idea that animals will 'come to you and sing their sweetest tunes' is rather odd. Its too anthropocentric for me. I mean, sure, you can fit your pet Pete there, but where do you place the lions and tigers in the afterlife? Wouldnt they be preying on us? Hunting us? Hunting other beings? Its kinda what constitutes what we know the be a Tiger, isnt it? Kinda disrupts the harmonious picture that people make the afterlife to be.

Maybe you can hold that the human mind is the first to become complex enough to survive as an independent entity, whilst 'lower beings' reincarnate until they gain the adequate complexity. Maybe I see that working out.. but then it would mean that some humans might not have a sufficiently complex mind to personally survive (they might survive in other ways).

[Eteponge]

The skeptics responding to the CNN article that Bruce Siegel posted are using a laughable false comparison tactic in the comments to dismiss veridical accounts of crisis apparitions ...

"In the early 1900s there were repeated reports of fairy sightings including the famous "Cottingley Fairies" which were a series of 5 photographs in 1917. This inspired Sir Arthur Conan Doyle to interpret the photos as clear and visible evidence of psychic phenomena. We look back on this time and laugh these fraudulent claims now, and no doubt we will find ourselves in a similar situation 50 years from now."

In addition, they pull what I affectionately call the "Universal Conspiracy Theory" explanation. The accusation that every single person who has claimed to have experienced a crisis apparition BEFORE they learned of the person's death, is a damn dirty liar, who made it up after the fact.

Comments like those make me glad that finally at age 31, after debating close-minded dismissive skeptics online since I was 19 or so, I've learned that it's fruitless and a waste of time and breath to try to argue or reason with them.

I hope that when these cynics pass on they remain in a state of ignorance and unprogression, believing themselves to simply be in an ongoing dream while their brain is still preserved somewhere, "I must be in a deep coma, that's it, and this is my dream, that's why it keeps going on and on!" Or, "I've been cryogenically frozen, that's it!", or, "I'm a brain in a vat, that's it! Science is keeping my brain alive! That's why I'm having this experience!" And never find their cynical way out of it. A waste of breath here, and there, lol.

[Eteponge]

The skeptic's comparing the "Cottingley Fairies" fraud to modern accounts of Crisis Apparitions, besides the obvious ridiculousness of that comparison, is basically saying, "This totally unrelated alleged paranormal event was once considered by a gullible paranormal researcher to be true, but it was a hoax, therefore all other totally unrelated paranormal claims are automatically a hoax as well, so stop wasting your time, in 50 years it will be laughable as well, if one thing's a hoax, everything's a hoax!"

[Art]

"Yeah Art but I dont think that the human being is the last chain in the spiritual evolution process. I mean, I suppose people say that animals would reincarnate," - 22
------------------------------------------

Just for the record, I am not a believer in reincarnation. Not all new age types are the same!

I'm the holographic universe guy who believes we are all connected to the Source, the Light, and come here to Earth to become separate, unique, individuals and everything living is connected to the source too.

But if ya'll want to reincarnate, be my guest! Me? Not so much! Once I make it to the other side I ain't leaving!

[zerdini]

Art has such fixed ideas that there is no room for compromise in any shape or form.

It is, therefore, pointless to try and put any other view.

[Barbara]

"I'm a brain in a vat, that's it! Science is keeping my brain alive! That's why I'm having this experience!" And never find their cynical way out of it. A waste of breath here, and there, lol."

Funny, and maybe it works like that, Eteponge. I was reading about some Atlantean and Lemurian fire elementals that still persist, even though their world has gone. They carry on thinking they're important by getting into the human unconscious and influencing us into believing in them! Perhaps after the paradigm shift, the atheist fundamentalists will do something similar.

[Bruce Siegel]

Art said:

"But if ya'll want to reincarnate, be my guest! Me? Not so much! Once I make it to the other side I ain't leaving!"

Here's the problem I see with that kind of thinking. It's based on extrapolating how you'll feel at some future time, based on how you feel today.

It's like certain skeptics who say: "Eternal life? How boring to spend an eternity being conscious. That's the last thing I want. No, I'm glad to know that when I die, I'll be snuffed out and exist no more."

Of course, this is a different viewpoint than yours, Art. But it's based on the same premise: I know what it'll be like when my body dies.

There is no way--literally and absolutely no way--for you to know for certain what you'll want when you leave your body.

Think about it: are you really willing to make a prediction that will cover your entire future into eternity? That's a long time.

[Bruce Siegel]

Let me add a little more to that:

I personally have trouble predicting what I'm going to want next WEEK.

And I like that. It means I'm open to all sorts of cool surprises.

[Bruce Siegel]

By the way, in referring to the attitude of "certain skeptics," I was thinking about Isaac Asimov. I think he once said something like that.

[Bruce Siegel]

Well, I guess I can't stop chewing on this bone. :o)

I don't mean to say that ALL extrapolation is impossible. I think we can have some inklings about the afterlife that may reflect the truth of what will actually happen and how we'll feel.

It's just the sense of absolute certainty as reflected in your comment, Art, that strikes me as unrealistic.

Make sense?

[Bryan.A]

"I mean, sure, you can fit your pet Pete there, but where do you place the lions and tigers in the afterlife? Wouldnt they be preying on us? Hunting us? Hunting other beings? Its kinda what constitutes what we know the be a Tiger, isnt it? Kinda disrupts the harmonious picture that people make the afterlife to be."

As for what I understand there is a very limited amount of animal types in the pet kingdom that would not reincarnate till they reach their highest form on earth that which is a bird.Don't ask me which ones are exceptions as I speculate dogs and horses.

But tigers reincarnate after many many ..many years into that house kitty that many have from what i've read so there wouldn't be a chance to have a tiger in the afterlife sphere.

Imagine a loose untrained and on earth bad temperament bulldog in the spheres of light,wouldn't he be naturally not be able to be there due to his nature?

I don't know how it all works but from all the accounts i've known everything in the harmony sphere has to be you know..harmonious,so either there's expanded consiousness in the afterlife for VERY limited and certain animals or there's something else i'm overlooking.

[Paul]

It's not like the Universe will care what our opinion on the matter is. I don't like the idea that hair grows in my ears but that doesn't change reality. :)

[Cyrus]

Art wrote,

"What limits us are out physical bodies and in the next life, while we may have a physical body if we choose to, I get the feeling that it's not a permanent thing but more of a "when you want to" sort of thing? "

I can't reconcile the idea of an afterlife without a physical body. But I can't reconcile an afterlife being stuck in another body. So I also think it's an optional thing. You need an instrument to experience certain sensations, limitations that being a ball of energy / consciousness may not be always able to provide.

[Paul]

How about an afterlife in a body you already have but don't realise?

[Zerdini]

XXII asked some questions to which I intended to reply but have only just returned from a holiday in the Mediterranean.

A journalist put the following questions to Silver Birch:

Question:
Do some animals spend their whole time with their human friends on the other side or is their real home on the animal sphere?

Answer:
It depends, because love is the index. You know that love determines the survival of animals. It is the love that exists between the animal and the person that enables the animal to obtain the temporary consciousness that exist beyond the grave of matter. If an animal, and I do not like the word "owner", because no one owns another soul, and the one whom it has served are in the world of spirit together, then the home of the animal is the home of the individual who has always loved it. It stays where love is, for love is the link that binds it to the one who loves it. It has no necessity go to the animal plane, because it has its home. Those who dwell in the animals sphere are the ones who come to the world of spirit before the masters, or owners, as you call them, arrive in our world, because it is necessary that someone shall take care of them. Otherwise they would be distracted, being cut off from the love, which not only warmed their hearts but breathed the temporary immortality into them. Where the animal comes to our world preceding the one who loved it, who gave it shelter and taught it all the habits of memory, of reason, of judgment and affection, it goes to the animal world to await the time when it can greet the one it has missed. There it is put in charge of those specially trained to look after animals, just as you have trainers in your world to care for animals when their masters and mistresses are away.

Question:
Will you describe what it is an animal obtains from human contact that makes it survive?

Answer:
In the long line in evolution, at some stage that Great Spirit or the law, breathed into the animal and it became a living soul, conscious, aware of its own existence. Then came the dawn of reason; intelligence bloomed; there was judgment, the ability to reflect, to decide, to weigh and to consider. But, potentially, all that existed no matter how far back in the line of evolution you go. It requires the breath of the Great Spirit to awaken it. Just as the Great Spirit enabled a divine spark to become a flame, so you, by love, transfer that process to the animal who lives within the shelter of your affection. You are part of the Great Spirit, having the power within you to transfer the tribute of spirit to the next in line of evolution, so that by your association, by radiating love, you awake that consciousness which, in time, through the process of evolution, would reach its own apex. Love is the keynote in all life. Death cannot still the voice of love in humans or in animals. Love is the driving force throughout the whole universe; love controls and governs all life; and love seeks to work through man towards all other creatures, whether they be his equal or his inferiors. The love that emanates from man to the lesser beings he embraces in his heart, the dog, the cat and the pets - cannot be ended by "death." It is love that determines that life must go on because love goes on.

Question:
How long does the survival of an animal last? Is it as long as that of a human being?

Answer:
No, there is this difference. At some stage the animal and human evolution inevitably part company. It may take, as you measure time, hundreds or thousands of years, but their rates of spiritual evolution are unequal. The animal has to be left behind because it cannot keep pace with the growing soul that restlessly struggles towards the greater light. Once you have passed from the vale of matter and accustomed yourself to conditions of the spiritual life, once you have realised that the ties which bind you to earth are severed, the desire to progress, the desire to unfold the surging divinity within becomes quickened. You seek to unfold all the qualities, which, by their practice, will enable you to be a greater service wherever you are. The higher you climb in the realm of spiritual unfoldment, the more difficult it is for the animal to keep pace with you. And so the love which kindled for a while a flame that burned beyond "death" gradually becomes attenuated. The flame flickers and it merges in the end with the group soul of that species.

Question:
Does that mean that the animal loses its personality and individuality?

Answer:
Yes. That is the clear distinction between the two evolutions, because the animal, as a group, has not yet reached the stage of evolution when the whole group is individualised. Otherwise it would cease to be animal; it would have then reached the stage of the human being. But because you enable it to jump the scale of evolution, because you enable it to advance by love, it means that it must return to the group out of which it is formed.

Question:
It sounds rather unfair that, because the animal has earned individuality for itself, it must return and lose what it has gained.

Answer:
No, because it has contributed to the group spirit and has enabled the process evolution to be advanced by its fraction of evolution. It contributes to the common stock. It adds a quota to the pool that before did not exist, in order to help the whole. The more such sacrifices are made, the quicker the group's soul advances towards the stage where it leaves the animal behind and earns the evolution which makes it now ready for individual souls in human form.

Question:
Is that when they definitely become incarnated?

Answer:

There are two kinds of incarnation. There is the old soul re-embodied in the world of matter and there is what you call the, "new soul," starting its first phase in the world of matter as an individual.

Question:
Do you mean as a human individual?

Answer:
Yes. They are both spirit, they are both conscious spirit, they are both individual spirit. But one is an old soul, returning to complete or help complete a cycle; the other is a new soul on the first rung of the ladder. The new one comes from the group, the group that once was animal, a pool of spirit which has been through all the evolutionary stages and animal, of bird, of fish, of reptile, right back to the lowest slime on earth.

That is Theosophical teaching.

I do not care whose belief it is. You should not tell me about labels. I am not interested. All these facetious critics who do not desire knowledge, who only seek to exhibit their vaunted intelligence, do not realise the simple truth. You do not bring a spider into your home and give it love, do you? You do not bring a beetled into your home and give it love and try to serve it. You do not give it companionship and the warmth of your heart, do you? No, because you recognise the gulf that is fixed between you, because you know instinctively that it is far away from you in the scale of evolution. You bring those whom you call the domestic animals - the dog, the cat, sometimes the monkey - because you feel a kinship with them. They are just below you in the line of evolution. They are ready for your love or affection because they are awaiting the next stage in their evolution, which is incarnation as humans. Question
Is the group's soul situated on the animal planes?

Answer:
I have one great advantage over you. I do not have to learn lessons in geography. We have no situations. Space is boundless and spiritual conditions do not occupy space. You are thinking in terms of physical location and spirit does not require habitation, unless it is to assume form. But a group soul requires no form. When it does, then it has to have a mode of manifestation and a place where that mode is manifested.

Question:
Do pet animals visit the spirit world and sleep?

Answer:
No.

Are they not familiar with it when they pass?

Answer:
No. When in your sleep state you come to our world you do so because you have your guides to take you by the hand. But none can do that for the animal except the one it knows, and that one is still in the world of matter.

Question:
Suppose that one had passed on?

Answer:
That is a little different, but I speak generally.

Question:
Why are animals, particularly cats and dogs, often more psychic than human beings?

Answer:
Because all though they have not as yet, as far as evolution goes, reached the stage where they become humans, they have not had to face "civilised" life that human beings do. If the human had not had the benefits of what you call "civilisation" then before now he would have reached the stage where the exercise of psychic qualities was part of his normal life. He has sacrificed that for his civilisation. The animal, not faced with the economic problems, with the sociological problems that affect human beings, has continued in the evolutionary line to the stage that humans should have reached, but have not, and therefore is in possession of those psychic qualities which humans have, but often repress, because of the material life they have to lead. Then again, those whom you call mediums are the precursors of the evolutionary line. They are exhibiting today what will be natural tomorrow.

Question:
Animals have what is called a sixth sense... they have premonitions and the ability to find their way over unknown territory. Is that a psychic quality?

Answer:
Yes, that is what mediums can do. But sometimes it is a quality of the species because; there again, you get a precursor of evolution manifest in one quality, like the pigeon, which has developed the one quality of finding its way home. It is called instinct, but it is really a form of lucidity. They are qualities, which are precursors to the line of evolution.

Question:
Sometimes when a medium describes a "dead" animal, it is accompanied by another one. Does one animal help the other to return?

Answer:
No, unless there was an association between the two animals already in your earthly world.

Is it always a human spirit who helps them?
Yes, because the higher helps the lower always. In is the law.

Question:
What sort of animals are on the animal plane?

Answer:
All those animals which were your pets, which you thought to be almost your equals, which you endowed with affection, with love, and stimulated their reason and the ability to think. Rather than that they should be lonely, disconsolate, lost without the one to whom they were attached, they come to this plane where they mingle with other animals and receive the special care of those who, have devoted their lives to the study of animals, are able to minister to them and to give them the kindness which is their natural expression. In this world they find all the things that will delight animals, all the pursuits of enjoyment that prevent them from fretting. And occasionally they are brought within the radius of the home, so that they can still feel the affection of the ones from whom they are part for a while. That is why so many sometimes see or hear the dog or the cat, even though they do not possess knowledge of spiritualism. They only know that there is a sense, or feeling, that the dog is there. And other animals always see them because of their higher psychic qualities.

Question:
Do the people who work on the animal plane bring them back?

Answer:
It is the ones who minister to them on the animal plane who bring them back because they would not come back with anybody else. And do you know who are the ones who minister to them? Those who were passionately devoted to animals and never had the opportunity of befriending them, just is in our world the children who pass before their parents are cared for by those who had strong maternal instincts, which were never satisfied. Dogs and the cats and all the pets are cared for by those who were devoted to them and did not have the means of lavishing their devotion upon them. Of course, they are aided by those who have specialised knowledge of animals, which is always used in our world. Knowledge is never wasted.

Question:
If an animal is ill when it passes over, does it get nursed, as human beings do?

Answer:
Yes, because there are many in our world who are glad to have the opportunity.

Are there different sections, or do the animals mingle?

No, the boundaries are fixed.

Though it is one animal plane, has it different boundaries?

Yes. It is very natural. It is not like a huge pen.

Are cat separated from the dogs?

Yes, they are.

Except the friendly ones, and I suppose they are near the boundaries?

Yes, it is all very natural.

Which is next in the line of animal evolution after the dog - the cat or the monkey?

The cat.

Why not the monkey, considering he is so much like us?

Evolution, as I have tried to explain, is not in a straight line. There are always precursors and retrogrades. Whilst man has developed in his line of evolution from the monkey, that pace has not been maintained and the dog has passed the monkey stage, largely because man has conferred friendship on the dog.

Did the monkey break the law?

They did not break the law, but they fail to live up to what they could have done.

Is it possible that in the future the dog will slip backwards?

No, I do not think so, because now, after all these millions of years, the species have become defined. The pattern has become almost standardised and the chances of physical evolution are diminishing. You must remember that there is a limit to physical evolution, in the sense that there can be changes in form, but not in the essential pattern there can be various, but not complete, changes. For example, take your physical body. You will not outgrow, for generations, this form, this shape - the two arms, two eyes, one nose, two legs. That pattern has now becomes fairly standardised. There will be variations according to race and country, but not changes in the pattern. This is more so in regard to the animals, so that there will be an emergence of the group spirit in the animal world but not so much in the physical world.

Would the slipping back of the monkey be the result of free will?

No, because it is a condition that affects the whole group.

How could the group will decide if it had no individual consciousness?

There is a difference between the behavior of animals according to their instincts and also lack of instincts. Even in animals, where there is no individual reasoning ability, there is a power either for labour or for idleness. It can respond, or fail to respond. It can sharpen up or awaken the instincts of the group. And, though it has no individual judgment, there can be, in the line of evolution, epochs where the whole species is failing to respond to what it is capable of doing.

Question:
How do you view the ever-increasing practice of experiments on living animals, often causing terrible pain to helpless creatures? Many people on this side are striving to get this unholy thing stopped. Is there any help in any way from the spirit world?

Answer:
All those who desire to serve at once bring to their aid those in my world who were inspired and sustain and bring them the power of the spirit to aid the work that they seek to do. It is wrong to administer pain to any of the creatures of the great spirit, but you must remember that there are many who do it in ignorance, not realising the pain that they inflict, only possessed with motives to help their fellow men. But they are still breaking the law.

Question:
But if, as we are often told, only the motive counts, will these people who inflict pain in what they conceived to be service to their fellow men have to pay the penalty for breaking the law?

Answer:
The motives may be good, but the principle is unaltered. If one deliberately inflicts pain, knowing it will hurt, that means that the one who does it is conscious of his responsibility. His motives, of course, are good, but he has inflicted pain. All these factors are taken into account, I cannot agree with the practice of inflicting pain.

Are animals sent to earth to help mankind?

Yes. And mankind is sent to help them.

But the sole purpose of the animal creation is it not to be of use to man.

No, that is only part of the work.

Do you believe that vivisection can be right when it is undertaken with a good motive?

No. How can that which is cruel be right? How can that which causes pain, which inflicts torture, be right? It is contrary to all we teach. It is wrong to experiment on those who are not capable of resisting.

Do you agree that no cure for cancer will ever be found by that method?

Your world cannot produce remedies for the diseases, which it has created by living contrary to the laws of the Great Spirit. There will be found remedies for all your diseases, but they will not be found by experiments on animals.

Why does not the spirit world interfere when it sees so many appalling atrocities committed on animals?

Because the Universe is ruled by natural laws.

At the end of these questions the guide made this comment:
"Just as animals strive to serve us with devotion, let us always try to serve others with equal devotion, with equal faithfulness, for it is all part of the divine love restlessly stirring which seeks to find expression everywhere. In a world that is so full of hatred and anger and jealousy, rage and fierce passion, it is increasingly necessary for divine love to be made manifest."

[Art]

Last night I dreamed about my little black and tan terrier, Hardy, that died last year. He was 16 years old when he died. I dreamed he was in a room with some other small dogs and I was trying take him with me and bring him home. Needless to say, I wasn't successful!

Oh yeah, Hardy is the little dog I'm holding in my Facebook picture.

[XXII]

Thank you, Zerdini. It is a wonderful read. Hopefully I can comment later, but from the quick read I just gave it, the material certainly adresses my questions.

[confused]

Sorry to interrupt the thread but does anyone on here Know anything about this UFO video. It's driving me nuts because I have never seen anything like it and it must be a hoax but it darn well doesn't look like one.

http://www.coasttocoastam.com/videos

It's on the right hand side of the page and is 22 seconds long (May 3rd picture of a palm tree..What are these) Surely it's a hoax isn't it or everybody would be talking about it, wouldn't they ?

Anyone, please ?

[Paul]

Yes zerdini - many thanks.

[confused]

Pretty please ?

[Michael Prescott]

It's a hoax. Very beautifully done, though. These days anyone with talent and the right software can create spectacular visual effects. Several video clips like this one circulated on the Internet a few years ago and caused some excitement before being revealed as a viral ad campaign. This may be one of those clips, or an imitation.

[confused]

Thankyou for clearing that up, Michael.

I wish people (the hoaxers ) wouldn't do this kind of thing, it's unsettling. Thanks again.

[justin bieber supra shoes]

I "like" you on Facebook. Would love these for my oldest boy!